Preventing feeding battle grangers through denybuild.

[nalf]

Hi, because in basically every game someone ruins it for aliens by granger-feeding, I made a very simple patch to prevent that: If someone is denied building rights, he cannot spawn as a granger. So if someone feeds, just voting denybuild will get rid of the problem. The patch is here.

[[{USATREM}] !Gunther!]

It's says in rules: "you can be a battlegranger, but expect to be teamkilled often". So, kill him. OR kick him, with the totally legitimate reason of "unneeded feeding and not killing".
There've been many situations when a S2 granger (me) saved a trapped egg with spit.

[nalf]

It's says in rules: "you can be a battlegranger, but expect to be teamkilled often". So, kill him.

With pleasure, but it costs me evos. Most such feeders don't care, they go granger again. I could lose all my evos and they'd still go battle granger.

OR kick him, with the totally legitimate reason of "unneeded feeding and not killing".

Eventually I would, but people are reluctant to kick for such a reason, because it's not part of the rules.

There've been many situations when a S2 granger (me) saved a trapped egg with spit.

Sure. But I'd say you were building and tried to save the egg, not that you were running most of the game in front of the human base, blocking rants and feeding humans.

[[{USATREM}] !Gunther!]

Then it's simple: make it so that when you kill a granger, you lose no evos, because grangers are free to anyone. A bit like dretches, but you can't teamkill those anyway so it's not much different.
And then the rules can take on a completely litteral meaning "expect to be team-killed often".

[TheWolfKiller]

Then it's simple: make it so that when you kill a granger, you lose no evos, because grangers are free to anyone. A bit like dretches, but you can't teamkill those anyway so it's not much different.
And then the rules can take on a completely litteral meaning "expect to be team-killed often".

I yet again have to clash with what you say Gunther...but if that were true:
1. People would less likely be granger because they can get killed by big aliens with no evo penalty (we already have lack of granger players at times, this wouldn't help).
2. People would freely kill grangers knowing the chance of them getting kicked is slim because they can always pull out the excuse "HE WAS BATTLEGWANGERING" The only way players would really know or not would be to spec the granger, and i doubt everyone would go spec JUST for that (and this wouldn't help the shortage of grangers).

In my opinion we should go with nalf's idea, or tone it down by not letting people spawn granger after SD unless the overmind is down (Most people battlegranger after SD anyway).

[Rotacak]

I think that this is already on server. Not sure if on 1.1 or 1.2.

But I do not agree with "no granger after SD", some lonely granger can sometime save aliens.

[TheWolfKiller]

I think that this is already on server. Not sure if on 1.1 or 1.2.

But I do not agree with "no granger after SD", some lonely granger can sometime save aliens.

(step it up a bit eh? now I'm debating with rotacak)

So in what way does granger save aliens after SD? The ONLY thing it can do is build om, and Bgranger and I'm saying they can/could spawn when om goes down.

Unless you put it this way: 2 players on aliens 1 goon and one gwanger at SD
1 player on humans.
Human player rushes, goon eats human base and forgets one node when "OVERMIND IS DYING" appears on screen.
Rushes to overmind, aliens have no base left. Human kills goon, and loses last 2 hp to poison, meanwhile granger sits on last node and eats it.

GRANGER SAVES ALIENS!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Other then that lol situation, i ain't gettin it.

[nalf]

I think that this is already on server. Not sure if on 1.1 or 1.2.

But I do not agree with "no granger after SD", some lonely granger can sometime save aliens.

I believe such a case is very rare. And if we allow grangers after SD when there is no OM so that they can rebuild, it's more than enough.

It simply depends on how we set the rules. We could say as well that we should allow aliens to build eggs after SD, because it can sometimes save them.

[Rotacak]

Granger after SD only when is OM down have one disadvantage. You have to die and spawn as granger. When is OM down, then around eggs are probably humans, so spawning as granger and running away is very hard and it take longer time.

But if is somewhere lonely SD granger, he can built OM immediately and on safe place.

Not to mention that SD granger is sometime only one alien (when you have low evo), that can fight against camped humans. Or atleast provoke them and lure them out.

[TheWolfKiller]

I can see why granger only being able to spawn AFTER overmind dies can cause problems. But i almost never see a game where overmind dies, gets rebuilt, and aliens win.

Just really never happens.

[[{USATREM}] !Gunther!]

I can see why granger only being able to spawn AFTER overmind dies can cause problems. But i almost never see a game where overmind dies, gets rebuilt, and aliens win.

Just really never happens.

Happened twice earlier this week

How would I know?
I was there.

[nalf]

Granger after SD only when is OM down have one disadvantage. You have to die and spawn as granger. When is OM down, then around eggs are probably humans, so spawning as granger and running away is very hard and it take longer time.

But if is somewhere lonely SD granger, he can built OM immediately and on safe place.

Agreed. But this means that there is a lonely granger, either doing nothing or worse feeding humans. I'm sure this hurts the team much more than losing a few evos to die, respawn as a granger and rebuild OM. (And if aliens have all their eggs near OM then rebuilding OM has no effect anyway, all eggs will be killed within a minute and the team loses.)

Not to mention that SD granger is sometime only one alien (when you have low evo), that can fight against camped humans. Or atleast provoke them and lure them out.

I agree on that. But this only happens with experienced players who know how to escape fast enough. That's quite rare. This happens much less often than inexperienced players feeding. And now when dretches can attack rets the need for sniping grangers is even less.

----

Happened twice earlier this week

How would I know?
I was there.

Gunther, I have a few questions for you:

• Was it during SD or not?
• In the cases during SD, was Overmind rebuilt by a player who was already granger (feeder/battlegranger) or was it rebuilt by someone who died to become granger and rebuild?
• How many times it happened last week that a granger was feeding humans during SD (at least during the time you were there)?

[/list]

[TheWolfKiller]

Yes gunther, lets hear it I doubt Picard can save you again...

[[{USATREM}] !Gunther!]

Gunther, I have a few questions for you:

Was it during SD or not? One game was, one wasn't
In the cases during SD, was Overmind rebuilt by a player who was already granger (feeder/battlegranger) or was it rebuilt by someone who died to become granger and rebuild? No idea about the first game, the second game humans rushed us and were stacked so I ran away and built new base
How many times it happened last week that a granger was feeding humans during SD (at least during the time you were there)? It's been about 2 weeks since I've seen anyone trying to granger-feed.

[TheWolfKiller]

Just an interesting side note...of the "2 weeks" how long did you play?
Because i've seen you once in the last two weeks...